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You can decide! Do you want to move to vBulltin? [update: 21st April]

Tue 14 Apr 2009, 11:58 by Shaolan

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Poll

Who is your fave of the seven seals? (And others)
Tsubasa Chronology Bar_left41%Tsubasa Chronology Bar_right 41% [ 46 ]
Tsubasa Chronology Bar_left41%Tsubasa Chronology Bar_right 41% [ 45 ]
Tsubasa Chronology Bar_left5%Tsubasa Chronology Bar_right 5% [ 5 ]
Tsubasa Chronology Bar_left3%Tsubasa Chronology Bar_right 3% [ 3 ]
Tsubasa Chronology Bar_left5%Tsubasa Chronology Bar_right 5% [ 6 ]
Tsubasa Chronology Bar_left0%Tsubasa Chronology Bar_right 0% [ 0 ]
Tsubasa Chronology Bar_left2%Tsubasa Chronology Bar_right 2% [ 2 ]
Tsubasa Chronology Bar_left4%Tsubasa Chronology Bar_right 4% [ 4 ]

Total Votes : 111

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Shaolan
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    Tsubasa Chronology

    CuteSherry
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    Post by CuteSherry Wed 13 May 2009, 20:26

    I was actually writing it for YamiSakura, and then thought why not share it since I've taken the pain to do the whole thing anyway aha~
    Because the order of events would be like this:

    -Clow Reed wishes *somehow...* for Yuuko not to die and her Time is stopped. She establish the Wish Shop and Clow Reed mourns, regretting to be so powerful...

    ********The World is twisted starting now********

    -Mom|Sakura is pregnant and starts having Dreams of the Future.
    -SxS son is born and 7 years pass~
    -Mom|Sakura meets HighSchool|Sakura in a Dream and is given the Star Wand.
    -the Star Wand is given to Yuuko as advance payment for the travel fees of the kid.
    -Dad|Syaoran reveals to his kid he's got to leave to another world where someone is awaiting his help.
    -Son|Syaoran goes to Yuuko, who sends him to Clow Country
    -Son|Syaoran spends 7 days in Clow Country
    -Son|Syaoran returns to his own world half dead after facing FWR and is healed by Yuuko (his parents fully paid for the healing fees, the payment itself is unknown of)
    -Son|Syaoran decided to go back to Clow Country, at the price of taking the risk of never returning to his home and maybe leaving his parents behind forever.
    -Son|Syaoran is back to Clow Country and 7 years pass~
    -RE-encounter with FWR, princess Sakura is devoured by the Death Seal in front of a helpless Son|Syaoran; the priestess Nadeshiko stops Time and while FWR is offering to Son|Syaoran a pact, Mom|Sakura Star magic breaks FWR's and Son|Syaoran is offered the option to rewind it all back...
    Mom|Sakura+Dad|Syaoran realize his wish with their combined magics, get youngers themselves together with their son, are stuck inside a tube, separated from each other and condemned to wait for a very long time until 'that time' comes, in which all the Magic they would have saved up for many years would allow them to come help later on. On the other side, the shrinked Son|Syaoran is condemned at his turn to end up in FWR's hands, while a new existence, Watanuki, replaces him and fill the gap of his absence in his Home World...
    -Time starts again in Clow Country from 7 years back ~7 years are rewound~: the people who knew about the Death Seal see their lives drastically changed --> Priestess Nadeshiko is dead. King Fujitaka becomes an archeologist. Clow Reed, who left behind his most beloved people (Kero, Yue, Clow Cards) travels to Clow Country and takes the position of King at the moment Time is rewound.
    -Meanwhile, Son|Syaoran is cloned and put inside a tube after sealing his Heart in his clone's eye.
    -Clone|Syaoran is sent to Clow Country and adopted by Fujitaka.
    -Clone|Syaoran meets princess Sakura, they become close friends.
    -Clow Reed foresee the Future of Clone|Syaoran, goes to Yuuko and give away the remains of his Life and Magic to pay for his Life in the Future. He goes back to his own home and accomplish his very last enchantment: the reincarnation of his wandering Soul in 2 people: Eriol and Fujitaka
    Clow Reed is dead. And Sakura, the Sakura Cards mistress should be born xxxx years later and take charges of his beloved people and surpass him.
    -7 years pass in Clow Country~ and inside the ruins, princess Sakura is cloned and her original body destroyed in the process; the memories are scattered in many feathers that escape in different Worlds in front of Clone|Syaoran helpless eyes.
    -Priest Yukito sends them both to Yuuko's shop where he meets Watanuki, Kurogane and Yuui and starts traveling through dimensions in search for the feathers that would save his beloved princess, ignoring the one in his arms is a not the original and the one he spent his childhood with...
    -Traveling through dimensions and getting back feathers
    -The seal weakens more and more and Clone|Syaoran starts to go back to his original self and looses consciousness of his acts sometimes
    -The seal is broken and Son|Syaoran is finally freed from his glass prison and sent to Yuuko's shop by Xing Huo, where he wishes to go to where his eyes is: Clone|Syaoran totally reverted back and attacks Yuui, gouging his eyes out; and we got a confrontation Son|SyaoxClone|Syao which ends up with Clone|Syaoran leaving...
    -The traveling continue, but this time around with Son|Syaoran; and Clone|Sakura is now conscious she is not the original princess through Dreams she got thanks to the recovery of the feather she received lately: before traveling again, she leaves one of her feather in Tokyo, inside the water, unconsciously giving birth to the future Clow Country she actually came from herself with this act.
    -Clone|Sakura soul goes inside a Dream and Yuui is freed from one of his curses. Clone|Sakura body ends up in Celes.
    -Yuui is freed from his 2nd curse and Clone|Sakura's body is recovered. Kurogane looses his left arm helping out Yuui to escape from the destroyed world.
    -Clone|Sakura body is stolen back in Japan and her soul comes to an end, scaterred in petals after being stabbed to death by Clone|Syaoran inside a Dream, in which he was fighting with Son|Syaoran over a feather.
    -Travel to FWR's stopped time, which ends up being a repeating interval of time of Clow Country.
    -Inside the ruins where the Time is completely stopped, Son|Syaoran tells his past to Kurogane and Yuui.
    -Fighting with Clone|Syaoran. Clone|Syaoran dies and disappears, wishing he had had the chance to hear Sakura finish her last sentence and says Sorry to his friends...
    -Fighting with FWR: Kurogane arms is destroyed, Yuui is koed, Son|Syaoran taking the frozen princess sakura hand gives no result at all; as planned by FWR, she fuses with the body of Clone|Sakura. Is it FWR's victory?
    -Inside Yuuko's shop, the tube breaks and Mom&Dad|SxS enter in scene and counter FWR's magic with their combined Star and Moon powers, stored for many many years. They start rewinding everything back to what it was, in order to re-establish the Order Of The World as it should be, from the moment it was twisted by Yuuko's time being stopped.
    -Yuuko arrives and face the *somewhat not dead anymore...* Clone|Syaoran and Clone|Sakura, who are given the chance to be born again thanks to Clow Reed and Yuuko's prices.
    -Clone|Syaoran must now choose the Future.

    ******************************************************

    As you can see, many things seems to make no sens: for example, it would mean that in the one same dimension there would be a Mom|Sakura who lived in Clow Reed times and another who would have been born a lot later with the exact same life and magic and who would meet back with Mom|Sakura and gives her the Star Wand, those two being one and the same 'Sakura' ^^;; EDIT: too unclear and messed up, it really shows you that I was brain dead after writing everything above ^^; It really would mean that Clow Reed past involuntary wish would have consequence in the future of his descendants; and Clow Reed would then leave his world to go to Clow Country after an action (time rewound by SxS) was made in the far future, in a moment he is supposed to be long dead in the past...so...as long as Clow Reed was not in his own world and didn't reincarnate in 2 people, the future in which Sakura is born is not supposed to exist (Clow Reed alive = Fujitaka Kinomoto does not exist), but it does! Both the *still* no-modified past and the *already* modified future co-exists, the same way as Acid Tokyo and Clow Country existed at the same time even though one is the 'consequence' of another @___@
    I guess it makes as little sens as Clow Country being born from Clone|Sakura leaving a feather inside the water reservoir of Acid Tokyo, and creating the future Clow Country that way...But she herself comes from *that* Clow Country!! But if it's like, Clow Country started to exist only after the feather was deposited, but then the one who put it there was supposedly created far FAR FAAARR after Clow Country was created itself ^^;;;;;
    But you'll realize the concept is the same in both cases listed above: 'someone' that is from the future state of a World does something in the past of that same World and their action actually are at the origin of *that* future the 'someone' came from: but how can the 'someone' be from the future that was the consequence of the modified past?...then where is the initial Future of the no modified past? @___@ *this is Hell*

    Anyway, forget it all, you don't have to care about anything weird out there, Clamp sugar coated all this nonsense under one line: "The Logic of the World is destroyed". With this magical sentence, everything is possible! Yay!! *A-HA-HA-HA.....*


    Last edited by CuteSherry on Tue 19 May 2009, 00:09; edited 9 times in total
    Misty
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    Post by Misty Wed 13 May 2009, 21:23

    lol, thanks so much for the summary of a..really long list XD

    What confused me the most is how can CCSakura and Mother Sakura could be living in the same dimension? Yeah, but still, I have a feeling they are not from the same dimension. I remmbered Mother Sakura said it once, that she met another "her" in a her dream from another dimension. So to sum up, they maybe the exact Sakura, but living in a differ timeline? eh..I don't know lol, it's really confusing XD
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    Post by Shaolan Wed 13 May 2009, 21:37

    CuteSherry wrote:
    -Fighting with Clone|Syaoran. Clone|Syaoran dies and disappears, wishing he had had the chance to hear Sakura finish her last sentence and says Sorry to his friends...
    -Fighting with FWR: Kurogane arms is destroyed, Son|Syaoran taking the frozen princess sakura hand gives no result at all and Yuui is on the ground too. Is it FWR's victory?
    -Inside Yuuko's shop, the tube breaks and Mom&Dad|SxS enter in scene and counter FWR's magic with their combined Star and Moon powers, stored for many many years. They start rewinding everything back to what it was, in order to re-establish the Order Of The World as it should be, from the moment it was twisted by Yuuko's time being stopped.
    -Yuuko arrives and face the *somewhat not dead anymore...* Clone|Syaoran and Clone|Sakura, who are given the chance to be born again thanks to Clow Reed and Yuuko's prices.
    -Clone|Syaoran must now choose the Future.

    Thanks for this timeline, it sure is helpful to get all the details back in mind. Though I guess you did a slight mistake in the order: C!Syaoran has to be revived before the fight-scene with FWR, otherwise how could he be there?

    CuteSherry wrote:
    But you'll realize the concept is the same in both cases listed above: 'someone' that is from the future state of a World does something in the past of that same World and their action actually are at the origin of *that* future the 'someone' came from: but how can the 'someone' be from the future that was the consequence of the modified past?...then where is the initial Future of the no modified past? @___@ *this is Hell*

    Well, there you get to the weakness of all stories that deal with changes in the past. Let's call our example Knut. So, Knut expereinces something in life so that he wants to make it unhappen. He goes to past and then ---wow--- he made it unhappen. Due to logic of time, now there is no reason anymore to go back in time and to change the past. Therefore he would not do it. Everything would be the same as before, wouldn't it? And: When does this start? If he was able to go back in time and he got this decission, every future self of him would've had the same idea. And every past self of him will do so, too. So the question is how time-travelling can lead to a result?

    In Harry Potter 3 we have a good example of timetravelling that is well thouhgt. There the heroes meet theor selves of the past and then they realize that thier future-selfs have changed the past before them and that they are doind what they were doing before (well, if you look at a timeline it should be "after"). In this story, there is almost no mistake in the logic, but one thing: When did this start? (I know i know, this question again^^'). For being logic, this must've started endless times before, but it is impossible to start endless times before, since this would mean that there is not start and no end and that makes every time-travelling story fail by human logic.
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    Post by CuteSherry Wed 13 May 2009, 23:09

    Misty wrote:lol, thanks so much for the summary of a..really long list XD

    What confused me the most is how can CCSakura and Mother Sakura could be living in the same dimension? Yeah, but still, I have a feeling they are not from the same dimension. I remmbered Mother Sakura said it once, that she met another "her" in a her dream from another dimension. So to sum up, they maybe the exact Sakura, but living in a differ timeline? eh..I don't know lol, it's really confusing XD

    About SxS being from CCS or not, there is just no other option: the fact "Syaoran is Clow Reed blood related relative" was repeated enough by both Yuuko and FWR in the manga for us to remember it for a life time ^^;;;;
    Starting from the moment Clow Reed is indeed established to be the same one as CCS's, then mom&dad|SxS can only be the ones from CCS too: there are the only ones who could have given birth to someone who could be said to be *blood related* to him, through the Li family.
    It's not about not understanding 'how can it be' or not. Clamp took great care in covering all the plot holes by making overthrowing the Logic of the World and twisting it FWR's objective all along, in order to make the impossible possible.


    Shaolan wrote:
    Though I guess you did a slight mistake in the order: C!Syaoran has to be revived before the fight-scene with FWR, otherwise how could he be there?
    Actually, Yuuko offered to C|Syaoran to be reborn together with C|Sakura but he concretely did not accept or refused that offer just yet...so as weird as it seems, as of now he is still somehow *dead* at this point ^^;; We already know that Yuuko is able to communicate with the souls of the dead thanks to everything being twisted (she met and talked with Doumeki's grandfather), it must be something like that maybe? Or is it because she is herself half dead somehow?
    I will change the chronology when new information are given if needed.


    I won't comment much on the time-traveling part because there is hardly anything I could add ^^;;
    The only Time-traveling that would 'make sens' would be if only a minor change is made; example: the guy goes to the past and change the position of....some book in a shelf, it will hardly change anything major in the future ^^; Or if you meet your past self and tell him : "OMG! Don't eat that, you will get one major indigestion in the next hour!"
    But yeah, when, like for Acid Tokyo and Clow Country, both the past and future of one same world exist simultaneously (when they are in Acid Tokyo, Clow Country already exists) and the heroes comes from that same country which is not supposed to exist until being made as a consequence of a determined action in its past, we are completely lost -___- Or better then lost, it just pure nonsense.
    Anyway, Clamp had made it clear for a while now that Time and Logic are destroyed, actually, you have to remember this was FWR's objective all along: the impossible and unthinkable was made possible thanks to the Logic being overthrown.
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    Post by Raj-kun Wed 13 May 2009, 23:23

    Great Summary. Thank you so much for your efforts.
    CuteSherry wrote:
    -7 years pass in Clow Country~ and inside the ruins, princess Sakura is cloned and her original body destroyed in the process; the memories are scattered in many feathers that escape in different Worlds in front of Clone|Syaoran helpless eyes.

    There's just one mistake you made. It was Fei Wong who thought the original body was destroyed. In reality, Yuuko took the body and has since been keeping it safe.
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    Post by amethyst-rose Wed 13 May 2009, 23:32

    Thanks for the time and effort you put into this, CuteSherry~ it was the Tylenol for my CLAMP headache XD;;

    Still, the thing that confuses me the most is all the time warping and stuff...it's makes me feel @___@;;; I never make sense out of that kind of stuff, it goes right over my head. I think Tusbasa is turning into a messed up Sci-Fi movie for me now hahahaha~~
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    Post by dawnferra Thu 14 May 2009, 02:11

    Woah, that is one long list. Thanks for your effort~!

    I am still somewhat confused, but this does clear some of it.
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    Post by misthafalls Thu 14 May 2009, 06:26

    You know the entire time mess, is the same as who comes first the chicken or the egg.

    Its just something you dont know. Then again time travel is weird, but sort of fun, cause it makes thing hard, but understandable in another way. (IMHO) :P

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