The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by Shaolan Tue 31 Mar 2009, 07:00

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Post n°1

The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by Shaolan Tue 31 Mar 2009, 07:00

Well, everthing seemed clear until reading chapter 217. We all know that Clamp love to twist plots but now again: It seem as if there are more Syaoran/ Sakuras than we expected. Regarding to the new chapter it seems as if CCS Sakura gave the adult Sakura her wand, so that the Lady Sakura gets power. And it seems as if that Lady Sakura is Syaoran's mother! So that would mean that Tsubasa would not be a sequel of CCS and that CCS is just another Cross-over! I think a few people here (won't tell names^^) will apprediate that fact^^. (Well, for now, but we don't know what clamp are going to do next chapter...)

What are you opinions about this?

Well, I fthink, the plot twists were very good but know I think it may be a little bit too much. I mean, that our CCS-couple are not Syaoran's parents is now a little bit disappointing for me. That Clamp put another S&S-Couple into the series is just a little bit too much. I mean, we have SakuraxSyaoran (the originals), Clones (and not to forget that there were 2 clone-sakuras: the body and the soul), the former supposed CCS ones and now the real CCS-ones (well, we haven't seen Syaoran grown up, but maybe this also comes). Ah, and we haven't recieved infromation about Yuuko's true past...so this really is very much at the end. but this also is really exiting^^

by YamiSakura Tue 31 Mar 2009, 07:18

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Post n°2

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by YamiSakura Tue 31 Mar 2009, 07:18

I will say it upfront that I will be the first to be against / upset about this twist if is true mad

It wouldn't make ANY sense ...
(A) we will put in the possibility that CCS|Sakura "lent her power" to son|Syaoran|mother ... then who in the world "lent the power" to son|Syaoran|father power which is both direct power from LI SYAORAN and even the same sword ><;;; I mean obviously CCS|Syaoran don't have dreamseeing power

(B) When I read that bit... I am thinking along the line of it "could" mean that the "different world" will be like a "past" and "present" world. Sort of like Shara and Shura in which they are the SAME country except they are in the different timeline.

(C) IF son|Syaoran|mother is NOT equal to CCS|Sakura then when teen|Sakura is talking to adult|Sakura, why would she say it as "This is your precious item, isn't it?" Which would mean that THIS power or item (star staff) do not only below to herself but at the same time also belong to adult|Sakura too [probably at one point]. And the "lent" power, I am thinking it as sort of like after son|Syaoran|mother gave the star staff to Yuuko as the price for her son to travel to Clow Country... her past self through dream travel to the "future self" to give the power "back" to help with the situation.

(D) I dislike this twist and I certainly DO NOT like how CLAMP first of all would throw us around with CCS|Syaoran hinting for MONTHS before the "true identity of R|Syaoran is revealed" ... then when it is NOW showed enough with the whole "star staff, CCS|Sakura's magic circle appearing, CCS|Sakura's golden phase at us" etc. THROW us in the face that ... "ha ha~ You are tricked by us once again... R|Syaoran's parents only have those power BECAUSE CCS|SxS lent them those power and items" Evil or Very Mad

THAT is just total BS since they are "playing" with their fans like that... and in that process just freaking throw in more Alt|Sakura and Alt|Syaoran into this mess ....

Last edited by YamiSakura on Tue 31 Mar 2009, 07:39; edited 3 times in total

by SakuraClowHIme200 Tue 31 Mar 2009, 07:28

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Post n°3

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by SakuraClowHIme200 Tue 31 Mar 2009, 07:28

Well I have no idea about this, really NO IDEA, I'm so confused!

But I do believe that the CCS!SxS are son!Syaoran's parents.

I agree with you Yami Sakura, that since little Sakura said to the adult Sakura "this is YOUR wand after all", adult Sakura has to be CCS Sakura and therefore son!Syaoran's mother.

Last edited by SakuraClowHIme200 on Thu 12 Jul 2018, 18:46; edited 2 times in total

by Seishirou Tue 31 Mar 2009, 08:15

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Post n°4

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by Seishirou Tue 31 Mar 2009, 08:15

Yeah.. I must agree NOW I'm disappointed!! I mean, there's so many SxS now that turned all the thing just... silly..

All we didn't need now is more Sakuras and Syaorans. CLAMP just played with us too much! For me now TRC is just uninteresting. We don't have any connection with these new SxS, they are totally strangers for us now. CLAMP must give a great great great explanation now, otherelse we would easily think "that's all?"

About FWR death (if he really died) it was disappointing too. I thought it was simple just to left him behind. :/

About CCS SxS, I guess they won't be around soon since the story has nothing to do with them.

At least the fact that Yukito is considered as blood related make sense since he is related to Mama and Papa..

EDIT: I agree with you Yami-chan!! I still belive MamaSakura is CCSakura and the diferent worlds could be a matter o time, since time, we know, is a thing to consider when the word world is metioned. That way.. CCSakura is Jr mother and TRC 217 is the big TRICK EVER!

Last edited by Seishirou on Tue 31 Mar 2009, 09:49; edited 3 times in total

by Hokuto-chan Tue 31 Mar 2009, 08:54

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Post n°5

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by Hokuto-chan Tue 31 Mar 2009, 08:54

Well. . . I would just say this new twist has curroupted my brain. . . too many SxS now. . . may we please just go with the story with the vamp twins? I'm sure their story isn't too brain wrecking.

by dawnferra Tue 31 Mar 2009, 09:58

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Post n°6

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by dawnferra Tue 31 Mar 2009, 09:58

Another set of SxS is seriously three too many. It is confusing when talking about one.

So, is Jr.'s real parents a real set of SxS or because they lent the CCS|SxS powers that gave them the SxS title???? If so, they just randomly came from another world??

This new twist is giving another headache. Moreover, I agree with YamiSakura that this is just BS.

by Shaolan Tue 31 Mar 2009, 12:01

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Post n°7

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by Shaolan Tue 31 Mar 2009, 12:01

Hmm, that theory of the different times would make sence...didn't Yuuko say once that Sakura gave her the original wand? So the question from the "little" Sakura "Is this your precios item?" (or sth similiar, didn't quote it correctly) would also make sence. Cause the old Sakura gave her wand to Yuuko and the littl one gives hers to the older one.

Well, it could also be that the young one gave it Yuuko, so that she would be able to hand it oer to the old Sakura in the dream. I guess, we can expect a good explanation here. And I hope we recieve it soon.

by Raj-kun Tue 31 Mar 2009, 18:46

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Post n°8

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by Raj-kun Tue 31 Mar 2009, 18:46

YamiSakura has totally got it right! And I'm wondering how the High School Sakura managed to travel to a different world?

by hatsuharupeace Tue 31 Mar 2009, 22:11

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Post n°9

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by hatsuharupeace Tue 31 Mar 2009, 22:11

Let's just say this. TRC was never a sequel to CCS. It was its own standalone series, right from the very beginning. Sure, it used the characters from CCS, but in essence, they were their own characters; very different from the original concepts from CCS.

So, back to the original question. I haven't read the chapter yet, but from your discussions, what I'm understanding is that CCS-Sakura from particular time and dimension gave her wand to ANOTHER Sakura from a different time and dimension. So, from this, the un-CCS Sakura gained magical powers from the wand.

I think what CLAMP have done by using this twist of a sort, is that they're trying to simply confuse us, as some of us have already been. I believe that CLAMP are also trying to tell us that the Syaoran and Sakura from TRC have no relation what-so-ever to the CCS Syaoran and Sakura, to show how there's no immediate link between them, and it is indeed, just a CSS crossover idea which CLAMP incoporated, which Shaolan mentioned.

by YamiSakura Wed 01 Apr 2009, 03:53

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Post n°10

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by YamiSakura Wed 01 Apr 2009, 03:53

hatsuharupeace wrote:So, back to the original question. I haven't read the chapter yet, but from your discussions, what I'm understanding is that CCS-Sakura from particular time and dimension gave her wand to ANOTHER Sakura from a different time and dimension. So, from this, the un-CCS Sakura gained magical powers from the wand.

(A) You should read the chapter first .__.

(B) As I was saying... IF we are saying that un-CCS|Sakura is just an alternative|Sakura from a different dimension (aka. same soul but different Sakura) and coincidently have the SAME magic power as CCS|Sakura because CCS|Sakura gave her magical power. THEN, we would have to say the SAME thing for un-CCS|Syaoran for "somehow" gaining magic power and sword from CCS|Syaoran. In which, as I said... HOW would that happen?? And I seriously doubt that CCS|Syaoran's magical power can just "pass/give" to another person as CCS|Sakura giving the wand or something -____-

(C) Like I said before, IF that wand merely belong to CCS|Sakura and she is just lending it to un-CCS|Sakura... then WHY would she said "This is your precious item, isn't it?". It wouldn't be "YOURS" if is never something that once belong to you

hatsuharupeace wrote:
I think what CLAMP have done by using this twist of a sort, is that they're trying to simply confuse us, as some of us have already been. I believe that CLAMP are also trying to tell us that the Syaoran and Sakura from TRC have no relation what-so-ever to the CCS Syaoran and Sakura, to show how there's no immediate link between them, and it is indeed, just a CSS crossover idea which CLAMP incoporated, which Shaolan mentioned.

Um... the "they're trying to simply confuse us, as some of us have already been"... are you implying to THOSE who believe that TRC has direct relation/connection with CCS -___- IF CLAMP really is trying to prove their point of "no relation what-so-ever", then they are certainly NOT doing it very effectively previously when they went through over 100 chapters throwing hints here and there with CCS|Syaoran's magic, CCS|Syaoran's sword, CCS|Sakura's magic circle, CCS|Sakura's star ward, mentioning of the name "Li Syaoran" >___>

They can easily NOT throw all those connection and hint in IF they really in the end just want to say, "trying to tell us that the Syaoran and Sakura from TRC have no relation what-so-ever to the CCS Syaoran and Sakura, to show how there's no immediate link between them, and it is indeed, just a CCS crossover idea which CLAMP incoporated"
instead of "hey, don't get so emotional/attachment/angst with how TRC will affect CCS's ending; we are only 'playing' with you guys as our goal"

ETA: For my point (C)... under cnet translation : "This is a very precious thing to you, isn't it?"
un-CCS|Sakura certainly wouldn't consider it as "precious" more like "useful" since it is something given to her not something she possess at one point.

by CuteSherry Wed 01 Apr 2009, 04:35

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Post n°11

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by CuteSherry Wed 01 Apr 2009, 04:35

April 1st in Japan, I decided to read the chapter....

The very moment I saw 3 Syaoran on the splash page I got a very bad feeling, but when I saw the actual chapter it was a complete downfall.

This has turned absurd.

There is no 'this is Clamp's genius plan' or 'Clamp have an idea' or nothing in there, so let's make it clear: if at this point of the manga, Clamp seriously want to establish that CCS|Sakura&Syaoran are not TRC|Syaoran's parents, the whole story has turned out completely and plainly ridiculous.

Thankfully, taking in consideration this twist really make no sens at all, it's very likely that what we've seen in this chapter should indeed be an encounter between the same 'Sakura' from the same world but 2 different moment in time...
......
....is what I would like to say, but it's not that easy Sad

If we really suppose that Adult|Sakura physically encountered her past self, the question that immediately arise is: how?
From what I saw, it's Teenager|Sakura who made the first move of offering the staff: how did she meet her adult self? Why? How come? Is there such a think as a power to travel in the future and physically meet your own self? Ok the staff was used as a price, but it's not like it was a major thing in the story either, furthermore, where did Adult|Sakura's staff went then? She lost it? It was destroyed?...etc...Furthermore, if teenager|Sakura says she can still goes one without the staff, why would her adult self (in theory more powerful then her past self) would need it for then?
It's really really REALLY unfortunate to say, but it's more plausible, given the past events we saw in both Holic and TRC those past years and like the translation says, to consider the possible encounter of 2 Sakura from 2 different worlds who would have met inside a Dream (and we know that the objects you took inside the Dream can come with you back in reality) better then Teenager|Sakura encountering who knows how her adult self (as of now, we never witnessed encounters between past/future of characters from the one same world) for something as 'little' as giving her staff and throwing an "<i>everything is gonna be alright</i>" as bonus -___-
And it's also worrisome that Adult|Sakura referred to the "everything is gonna be alright" sentence, as something passed to her from someone else, while it supposedly should be her own line too...

I won't list the reasons why it should be CCS|Sakura, Yamisakura did a great job with it above and pointed out very strong points ^___^ So hey! Someone had to give the bad points of this chapter! *and I took the job*

I will cross *hard* my fingers and I will seriously concentrate and sincerely believe those 2 are CCS|SxS, else TRC is simply a goner a this point, as said before: absurd.

As for the reason why father and son are perfect copies of one another, and same with the 2 Sakura, I gave up on understanding that part -__-

EDIT: I might have taken this whole scandalous chapter a whole lot better if Clamp actually graced us with a shot of an adult|Syaoran but....they didn't! fire

EDIT2: I just thought about something else -> The mystery behind Yuuko saying she got Sakura's staff but never met her is resolved : Yuuko said she never met the owner of the staff...if we consider we got 2 different Sakura, it means that Adult|Sakura gave Yuuko the staff as a price but Yuuko logically *and truthfully* said it was not the 'owner of the staff' she met ;__;
ARRRGGG!! I will stop thinking, only 'bad stuffs' comes to mind!!
That's it! Decided! TRC|Syao parents are CCS|SxS until an irrefutable proof of the contrary is given, which has yet to happen. Ah~ I feel better now ^^

by Hokuto-chan Wed 01 Apr 2009, 06:47

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Post n°12

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by Hokuto-chan Wed 01 Apr 2009, 06:47

You know what, I have a very, very, very, very strange feeling that Adult/Sakura might be Yuko. One, we heard that Yuko CLEARLY RECIEVED the wand. We DON'T know Yuko's REAL name, and the anount of Sakura and Syaorans are killing me!

by YamiSakura Wed 01 Apr 2009, 07:41

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Post n°13

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by YamiSakura Wed 01 Apr 2009, 07:41

Hokuto-chan wrote:You know what, I have a very, very, very, very strange feeling that Adult/Sakura might be Yuko. One, we heard that Yuko CLEARLY RECIEVED the wand. We DON'T know Yuko's REAL name, and the anount of Sakura and Syaorans are killing me!

You are saying that CCS|Sakura through that encountance gave the wand to Yuuko=adult|Sakura, right?? BUT you need to remember adult|Sakura = R|Syaoran's mother.
Your very, very strange feeling would be suggesting, she (adult|Sakura) receive a price from CCS|Sakura, then wait for little|Syaoran (her own son) to arrive to her shop [why not just do it at her own home :P] and then by the "price" CCS|Sakura paid, she grant him the wish and sent him off to Clow Country x___x
And plus Yuuko don't have the same magic circle as Adult|Sakura anyway, so it is not going to work out.

Last edited by YamiSakura on Wed 01 Apr 2009, 07:43; edited 1 time in total

by Hokuto-chan Wed 01 Apr 2009, 07:43

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Post n°14

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by Hokuto-chan Wed 01 Apr 2009, 07:43

. . . You're really good at making points, Yami-chan. Nevermind then, I'm tired of making theories since CLAMP is screwing everything up now.

by moezy-chan Wed 01 Apr 2009, 12:30

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Post n°15

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by moezy-chan Wed 01 Apr 2009, 12:30

Ok...I'll see if I can make sense of this chapter @_@ Please feel free to correct me...in fact, I WANT IT, cause I'm just getting another headache! D<

Kay, if we think of what Yuuko said, from the last chapter, and forgive me v_v I have never read xxxHolic. Just never interested me for some reason...well anyways. Yuuko said that she never met CCS&S. So, if we go by that, it would be true if CCSakura gave her wand to the AU!Sakura, and the AU!Sakura gave it to Yuuko. So, it would make sense in that regards...

And that's all I'm saying for now...all this is just giving me one huge migrane, and making me think violent things towards CLAMP...and I'm not a violent person x_x

by Smile_For_Me Wed 01 Apr 2009, 14:10

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Post n°16

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by Smile_For_Me Wed 01 Apr 2009, 14:10

LOL my rant and idea for the whole thing

Spoiler:

Have fun...I just confused myself.

by hatsuharupeace Wed 01 Apr 2009, 19:57

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Post n°17

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by hatsuharupeace Wed 01 Apr 2009, 19:57

YamiSakura wrote:
(A) You should read the chapter first .__.

(B) As I was saying... IF we are saying that un-CCS|Sakura is just an alternative|Sakura from a different dimension (aka. same soul but different Sakura) (...)

(C) Like I said before, IF that wand merely belong to CCS|Sakura and she is just lending it to un-CCS|Sakura... (...)

I should indeed, but it doesn't really matter, for now anyway.

Not neccessarily. It can be taken in a few different ways. In my own thinking, the way I'm interepreting this is that the Un-CCS Sakura didn't have magic powers, until she recieved the wand from CCS Sakura. With Un-CCS Syaoran though, what I'm guessing is that in *his* dimension, he had magic powers. Remember, though the soul is the same, it doesn't mean that the person itself can't also be the same person from another dimension. The dimension concept, I admit, can be tweaked in many ways, and that's probably how CLAMP devised it originally, to make the readers think about the different possibilities. But yes, there is a possbility that CCS Syaoran passed his magic to Un-CSS Syaoran. Pull out your eye and stuff it into the other, anyone? ^^

Just read the chapter. I get it. It's simple, to a point where my brain is telling me I'm wrong. But yeah, let me explain it. It's not that Un-CCS Sakura didn't have powers in the first place, its the fact that she DIDN'T have a method to use her magic. The staff. The staff and the cards from CCS. Those play a very significant role in the chapter, especially in pg 8. What CCS Sakura was trying to say is that they both had a staff once an upon a time, yeah? So, in order to choose the future, like what Un-CCS Syaoran said, CCS Sakura gave Un-CCS her wand. Why? We don't know yet, I presume.

YamiSakura wrote:
Um... the "they're trying to simply confuse us, as some of us have already been"... are you implying to THOSE who believe that TRC has direct relation/connection with CCS -___- IF CLAMP really is trying to prove their point of "no relation what-so-ever"(...)

Japanese is a very complicated language. When translating, most translators try to translate the script literally, which you end up with those clumpy sentences which barely make sense. The advanced translators, however, translate them in a very figurative light, to make the script flow a lot better. What cnet translated there, I believe, isn't the exact literal translation, but the figurative translation so the readers will understand what is going on.

So, with that said, precious and useful could both mean certain meanings in the chapter. Precious, meaning that un-CCS Sakura HAD one before, and is still a precious item, even though she doesn't have it anymore. Useful, meaning that Un-CCS Sakura may have some use for it in the future, thus the sentence which Un-CCS Syaoran said, "to choose the future." I wouldn't downplay that scene at all right now, it could be a very important part of explaining the whole TRC story.

CLAMP may have hinted it, but it was never heavily implied. CCS is just a crossover element into TRC, meaning that certain aspects of it will feature in it. It just so happens that CCS is the primary element in the TRC manga.

If I heavily confused you, just PM me, I'll try and explain it a bit better to you.

by Rayna Thu 02 Apr 2009, 07:40

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Post n°18

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by Rayna Thu 02 Apr 2009, 07:40

Is it possible that Adult|Sakura never even received the Star staff from Teenager Sakura? Perhaps Adult|Sakura always carried the staff herself, but was merely contemplating on whether or not to hand it over to Yuuko...What happens if the dream was a representation? (Teenage Sakura was merely holding the staff as a visual aid; acknowledging it's importance but not physically handing the staff over.) In the onemanga translation, Sakura says "..and it gave me strength." Not "she gave me power." That is of course if we're looking at the theory that Adult|Sakura is CCS|Sakura grown up...

by Shaolan Sun 05 Apr 2009, 12:49

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Post n°19

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by Shaolan Sun 05 Apr 2009, 12:49

Well if you think about the possability that Old Sakura remembers her younger self...what she used to say then. Maybe you are right. But we can't tell until we have read the story till the end. As we know clamp they could change everything in the last chapter.

by Smile_For_Me Sun 05 Apr 2009, 14:23

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Post n°20

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by Smile_For_Me Sun 05 Apr 2009, 14:23

Well I don't think that CCS Sakura, and the Older Sakura are the same person. Because the look of shock on the Older Sakura was a lady like, "WTF". None the less, she knew what to do with it.

by chibi-chan Sun 05 Apr 2009, 23:34

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Post n°21

Re: The newest plot-twist (Contain spoiler from TRC 217)

by chibi-chan Sun 05 Apr 2009, 23:34

At this point, TRC is getting weird and hard to comprehend. Now we know the fact that Lady Sakura is another version of CCS Sakura. We really don't know much about Lady Sakura so we are not certain whether she is CCS future self or not. Clamp didn't make it clear enough. From ma point view and theory:
I see that, Lady Sakura is CCS Sakura future self after all. CCS Sakura is known as to be a powerful magician right? She has de dream seeing power just like Clow so, she saw her future self being trouble so she went in to her dream and gave her star wand to Lady Sakura. You can see Lady Sakura's surprised expression when CCS Sakura handed her her star wand. Why Lady Sakura's expression looked surprising? Because she knew this is her precious item. oh, wait maybe imma can be wrong.. My other impression about this maybe, Lady CCS Sakura isn't the same person CCS Sakura at all. She did say " my other self from another world whom I met in my dream" which perhaps possibly means that Lady Sakura is just another CCS Sakura encounter from another alternate dimension, so they cannot be the same person and which is likely mean that, Real Syaoran isn't CCS|SxS's son T_T

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